Re: Has three a hit critical mass

by Skipper11x Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:28 pm

It seems to me that us forum dwellers are not needed (or listened to) and the powers that be would prefer we weren't here and so are doing their best to force us away, us and those pesky 3aa members.
And what the fuck is up with these no notice sales that happen at 2am for me. 3a are doing their best to get rid of some of their most loyal supporters and I'm starting to take the hint myself.

by Plastic Robo Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:07 pm

Skipper11x wrote:It seems to me that us forum dwellers are not needed (or listened to) and the powers that be would prefer we weren't here and so are doing their best to force us away, us and those pesky 3aa members.
And what the fuck is up with these no notice sales that happen at 2am for me. 3a are doing their best to get rid of some of their most loyal supporters and I'm starting to take the hint myself.

Forum dwellers and pesky 3aa members - not needed, powers that be would prefer we weren't here.
And where did you get this information from Skipper?? The last part about unannounced sales on Bambaland I totally agree with (and hate with a passion) but the first part of your argument is just another rant from you. Try and stay focused on the real problems and not conspiracy theories. I bet you use to watch the X-Files a lot all those years ago! So did I, but it seems you didn't let go when the series finished up!

by Skipper11x Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:13 pm

Dear Mr Plastic, everyone has their own opinion, you have yours, I have mine.
As for where I get my information from I would have thought the opening phrase "it seems to me" explained it all, it's my opinion, if I'm the only one with that opinion who cares (apart from you obviously) and I'm still hanging in there. I've been here a long time and will remain here for the rest of 2015 possibly 2016.
Tally Ho my good man.

by fluppeco Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:38 pm

can't help but feel the venture exclusives are very excessive compared to previous ventures. I see kitties, clear legs, some new very limited 24" lines, cool books, warehouse stuff, art, posters, masks, the exclusive sets and I'm probably missing some more. it's of-putting, this used to be a fun and engaging dynamic I had with 3A, now the fun is only for the asian market or the ones who can spend without thought. the rest has to make due with the leftovers or weak derivatives of great exclusives or old releases. and were is my stuff I preordered more than a bloody year ago! shame on you 3A! piss off!

by papamadoo Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:01 pm

Something to be sure is, we can expected probably the same threatment for the pseudo AK Penumbra 4 pack LTD on Bamba.

and it absolutly sure it will be enven worst for the other not said to be on bamba from Venture

by carryingthebag@yahoo.co.u Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:47 am

I am in general agreement with Chico. Not gonna completely give up but affected by recent situation. How 3a looks after fans not able to make Japan Venture who buy in through Bamba is going to be a big decider for me.

by BPP Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:22 am

carryingthebag@yahoo.co.u wrote:I am in general agreement with Chico. Not gonna completely give up but affected by recent situation. How 3a looks after fans not able to make Japan Venture who buy in through Bamba is going to be a big decider for me.

That's a bit of a 180 in under a month...

Re: shipping schedule visualized
Post by carryingthebag@yahoo.co.u on Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:39 pm

I love this thread! Totally hilarious. Looking every day for new posts first. So much negativity. 3A are doing so many great things. I don't buy into many of them, I am discerning about what I get. If I have to wait a bit longer than expected then so be it. Food, drink, shelter I've got covered. No one dies if a toy takes a while to arrive. Having something pending delivery from 3A is one of those bitter/sweet life experiences, "I want my 3A delivery? where is my 3A? why is 3A taking so long? oh-no I've now got my delivery now I've nothing to look forward to from 3A; whens the next drop?". Well done 3A for not reacting to a lot of the Emo. Never apologize, never explain for being what you are! Just keep up the originality.

by dedguy Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:10 am

Chivo wrote:What ever happened to the 3A for lifers? For me I'll continue to buy what I like 'til I don't or 'til I can't one way or another. I won't let the "issues" of collecting get to me to the point that I end up angry and turning what was once fun into something that I look back at with disgust. That just doesn't make sense to me.

For me it became a matter of literally being unable to buy anything due to the way I manage my money as well as my busy schedule. Having essentially no notice before a sale made it far more trouble than I could deal with to actually buy anything. I could maybe deal with the other stuff if it was actually feasible for me to be able to complete a purchase. In 2014 I missed something like 10-15 things I wanted to buy but was unable to due to the way ThreeA sells things.

Being told by ThreeA staff to just set aside hundreds of dollars in a checking account as a solution didn't make things better. Sorry but I have better things to do with my money than have it sit uselessly in case ThreeA makes something I want.

by ghostmouse Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:34 am

A lot of people say a lot of things with truth and sincerity but time and circumstances change things. Lifers want to be lifers at the time of saying it but if what you're committing to doesn't commit back then what's the point. You could look at as marriage. When you marry you commit to life but I'm sure many would rather leave a poor marriage than stick with it and always be upset at what their partner does.

by abex44 Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:41 pm

The problem is an inevitable one when looking at the scope that any business plans for, which is growth.

I know most people on the boards expected years ago that growth would change the business model. However, I don't think many of us knew exactly what that would entail to it's full extent.

The main issue I know we all on here take issue with is QC problems and delayed shipping times. I believe 3A has not planned for growth on certain crucial fronts to keep the dedicated fans happy and far too often makes poor excuses for these issues. Plainly threeA has not planned appropriately for the growth despite trying to keep ALL buyers (old and new) as happy as possible.

Frankly I applaud their effort, but I have been put off as of recent in some of their practices. The same testament stands as always: "buy what you like." I know I am no longer devout on buying everything 3A puts out and I think that is important to keep in-scope for those who have been following the threeA wave over the years.

Sadly the magic is long gone, but I highly doubt that this business is dead.

by Chivo Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:28 pm

Magic always disappears as it is only an illusion. Wink

We must focus on the real now for that is what is. And know that what is can change and create new magic.

by Musahi13 Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:29 am

qc is way down and the paint apps have suffered since the absence of paint master LOK. How long can new fans be strung along before they bail and all you read about is negative reviews of the toys and shipping times. Three a buzz has been dying down.

by noveltycross Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:47 am

Thats one of my biggest let down with the Battlechild set. There is a huge distinction on paint applications between older figures and the newer figures. Even the new Zombacle heads paint app looks rushed.

by Crem Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:48 am

I've definitely found my interest to be waning for 3A and it's offerings.Most of the stuff I've liked in recent times have been exclusives made for the Asian cons and expos which are pretty hard to come by at a decent or fair price and with those items out of reach,I tend to reach less for anything ThreeA.
There are too many products/licenses at this point and the quality and creative feeling of pieces seem to be wearing thin (IMO).there have been years of promised items( peppermint bothead,etc.) that just never get done and we as the consumer are left hanging with little we can do.
I find it hard to care about most items I receive at this point- usually delivered long after the thrill is gone.And then when they do show,plenty have arrived with issues which further the feelings of meh...
I guess we grow out of phases and likes,I just never thought I'd be there with 3A- I so bought into the early promises and company construction and have hung out since hoping the magic will return....it just hasn't.
Lines like WWR and AK are virtually at a standstill- the once flagship lines are near afterthought and the most recent AK offerings are a limited set for the Asian market...No Johan for the folks like myself who beat the drum for the silly ass character in the first place,but if you can afford to go to japan,you might have a shot to own one.Too many hoops to jump through for toys.then they go to flippers and sit unloved/unwanted til they are all but forgotten...but I guess ThreeA already got paid,who gives a shit who has to pay aftermarket prices am I right?
It's sad,i really loved this company,it's products and the community that was/is responsible for - but what it is today has very little feel of what and how it was.i personally am not happy with the direction they are going- but they are making money and their fan base grows...but it also is shrinking- and what it's losing or has already lost is the folks here who used to speculate on story and background on characters- we/they are what brought the mythical feel to this company- without it,they are just becoming toys- and that's what everyone's making...

by Joshimus Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:37 am

I've been with 3A since 2012 or 2013 so I am hardly one to judge them on how things were and are now. I know that wait times do bother me too and the typical "Sorry for the wait, See our blog" isn't very helpful, but the newsletter and shipping schedule are there for a reason. Delays happen, I get that. I don't fault them when a release gets pushed back. From what I have read, Sideshow is the same. To me, it's not a big deal to wait a bit longer. Although this year it certainly seems longer than past years since I have been with them and yeah, CQ issues seems to happen a bit more for me this year too. I mean, Mars for example. Blue Ghosts one arm elbow was super loose. I fixed it pretty quickly. Mars Swirl has fallen on the floor at 6' heights several times and still holds strong. So how does one look at that? On one hand, one is built tough, the other has one issue that was easily fixed. I honestly can't call that a big issue, in my case anyway as I have read nightmares from others.
The Cornelius TK head a head issue that was resolved with replacements. TKlub has taken a LONG 2 years to complete. I still think 1 is left? I think. Maybe not.
Delays seem longer than when I first started. Hex was due 2 months ago, maybe see her before Halloween. Cowbot Footcutter, who knows when. I bought it based off a drawing and I still have no idea what to expect. Dredd line has taken it's time rolling through. Lots and lots of things can be said but all in all, I still don't feel like we have been abandoned.
Yes, exclusives that I clearly cannot attend, I am pretty well sol. I would like to see more 3AA opportunities for convention exclusives that don't sell out on Bamba after 20 seconds.
My buying this year has gone down as well, but mostly because I am focusing on figures and characters that hold more meaning to me. I want to finish TKlub, so I will. 2000AD line, yup. Transformers, check. Marvel and DC, certainly on my list. Star Wars, oh yeah. The rest I am taking a breather from.

Maybe I am still jaded for being still somewhat new, but I am not angry with 3A. It's still a business and they make nifty collectables so, I can deal with the few bad apples (QC) and delays when I am confident the toys will come. I have about 5 things coming this month after nothing for 2 months.
I just got my first Hot Toys figure Optimus Prime. Fantastic figure but his one right hand is missing the pinky. Already spoke to them and will be getting it replaced. So, again, do I get made at the QC issue or should I be glad that they will make it right? I choose the latter. He still has a complete gun hand so that just means I use that for now. Not a big deal. I want the one hand replaced, at the price it should be, but I am not made at Sideshow either.
Issues I have had with 3A have also been corrected, most of them anyway.

There are worse things in this world than delayed toys and QC issues they are trying to fix. Be glad that's ALL the problems you have.

by dedguy Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:48 am

This isn't directed at anyone, just a random thought before bed. I really wish people would stop using "it's a business" as an excuse for poor customer service and poor quality products. It really makes no sense.

I hear "they don't owe you anything" a fair it as well. Which really makes no sense. If I have given a company money for a product that's about as clear an example of something being owed as I can think of.

by Argentix Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:02 pm

I don't really have anything revolutionary to add here, but I will share some basic theories. Typically my comments are praised for reflecting the thoughts and emotions of frustrated fans that are either not willing or not able to express their sentiments in writing - however it is quite obvious to even the most casual observer that ThreeA as a company and as a creative force has changed their tune and is in all probability not going back to the way things were in the beginning.

Balance, it is what lies at the core of all entrepreneurial endeavors; the never ending struggle between creating a quality product and selling it at an effective pricepoint - all while making enough profit to stay afloat with hopefully some funds for improvement. The trade-offs are simple and recursive: More quality means higher prices -> Higher prices equate to increased risk. In economics, we learn that most people are risk averse - meaning their fear rises exponentially the higher the stakes are. This is why crowdfunding and micro-transactions are so successful: No one thinks twice about paying 50 cents for a digital app, but at $300 per WWR figure the chances of making a profit are significantly greater.

As their customer base has expanded, it has become harder and harder for 3A to produce the more involved figures that were prominent 4 years ago because time = money. This is another factor at play that has shifted the balance to what we have now. In conclusion, it is smarter for ThreeA to capitalize as much as possible on smaller, simpler products sold at lower pricepoints since they can keep their risk down, satisfy larger orders faster and maintain consistent quality control easier. Making the larger, more complex robots less frequent and limited also fits these advantages.

Of course, that doesn't explain the abundance of Isobelle figures compared to AK or WWR humans. This, I believe is simply a measure of market preference - or to be blunt: Tits sell. Really, they do. This effect is especially true within Asian cultures (the significant portion of 3A's market base) wherein collecting female figures is less of a social faux pas compared to Western ideologies.

It's all just business - it always was. Those who say that the early days of 3A were fueled entirely by some sort of artistic passion alone are fools. The audience has grown and sadly the products must shrink to accommodate this. It is the unfortunate and inevitable side effect of success.

by Chivo Tue Sep 15, 2015 2:28 pm

dedguy wrote:...

I hear "they don't owe you anything" a fair it as well. Which really makes no sense. If I have given a company money for a product that's about as clear an example of something being owed as I can think of.

To speak on this point, I think when people say this, they mean the company doesn't owe you anything beyond what you have paid for and basic customer service. I think some folks who have supported a company for a long time sometimes get it in their mind that the company owes them something for all these years of support. And although yes it would be nice if a company would acknowledge your years of support, we forget that companies are businesses that need to make money, not charities that give it away.

by ESeffinga Tue Sep 15, 2015 4:53 pm

I originally was intentionally not posting thoughts in this thread, but...

Chivo wrote:To speak on this point, I think when people say this, they mean the company doesn't owe you anything beyond what you have paid for and basic customer service. I think some folks who have supported a company for a long time sometimes get it in their mind that the company owes them something for all these years of support.

I think that is quite true. And it brings to mind a response Neil Gaiman wrote to a fan via his blog about 6 years ago, about this odd relationship of entitlement that fans often generate (including myself) about the "next" thing. In my case, I'm 3 Dirty Bertie's in and I'd like the other 9 to come as quickly as originally announced. But the only thing 3A really owes me art the first three that I ordered. I'm mentally invested in the WWR line, but it's been a slow grower for the last couple years. I see other lines taking away time from what I want to see, and I want more of what I like and get frustrated when I don't see it. I think we all do this to an extent.

Anyway, I highly recommend giving this a read, as it sometimes pops up in the back of my mind when I catch myself in this mindset.

http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2009/05/entitlement-issues.html

by Dar Wolfram Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:11 pm

Crem wrote: I've definitely found my interest to be waning for 3A and it's offerings.Most of the stuff I've liked in recent times have been exclusives made for the Asian cons and expos which are pretty hard to come by at a decent or fair price and with those items out of reach,I tend to reach less for anything ThreeA.
There are too many products/licenses at this point and the quality and creative feeling of pieces seem to be wearing thin (IMO).there have been years of promised items( peppermint bothead,etc.) that just never get done and we as the consumer are left hanging with little we can do.
I find it hard to care about most items I receive at this point- usually delivered long after the thrill is gone.And then when they do show,plenty have arrived with issues which further the feelings of meh...
I guess we grow out of phases and likes,I just never thought I'd be there with 3A- I so bought into the early promises and company construction and have hung out since hoping the magic will return....it just hasn't.
Lines like WWR and AK are virtually at a standstill- the once flagship lines are near afterthought and the most recent AK offerings are a limited set for the Asian market...No Johan for the folks like myself who beat the drum for the silly ass character in the first place,but if you can afford to go to japan,you might have a shot to own one.Too many hoops to jump through for toys.then they go to flippers and sit unloved/unwanted til they are all but forgotten...but I guess ThreeA already got paid,who gives a shit who has to pay aftermarket prices am I right?
It's sad,i really loved this company,it's products and the community that was/is responsible for - but what it is today has very little feel of what and how it was.i personally am not happy with the direction they are going- but they are making money and their fan base grows...but it also is shrinking- and what it's losing or has already lost is the folks here who used to speculate on story and background on characters- we/they are what brought the mythical feel to this company- without it,they are just becoming toys- and that's what everyone's making...

Has three a hit critical mass - Page 2 Slow_clap_citizen_kane

by fluppeco Wed Sep 16, 2015 3:20 am

ESeffinga wrote:I originally was intentionally not posting thoughts in this thread, but...

Chivo wrote:To speak on this point, I think when people say this, they mean the company doesn't owe you anything beyond what you have paid for and basic customer service. I think some folks who have supported a company for a long time sometimes get it in their mind that the company owes them something for all these years of support.

I think that is quite true. And it brings to mind a response Neil Gaiman wrote to a fan via his blog about 6 years ago, about this odd relationship of entitlement that fans often generate (including myself) about the "next" thing. In my case, I'm 3 Dirty Bertie's in and I'd like the other 9 to come as quickly as originally announced. But the only thing 3A really owes me art the first three that I ordered. I'm mentally invested in the WWR line, but it's been a slow grower for the last couple years. I see other lines taking away time from what I want to see, and I want more of what I like and get frustrated when I don't see it. I think we all do this to an extent.

Anyway, I highly recommend giving this a read, as it sometimes pops up in the back of my mind when I catch myself in this mindset.

http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2009/05/entitlement-issues.html

I think those kind of people are a very very very small minority. In fact, I think I've never seen someone asking for something that wasn't paid for. We all are entitled to the products we invested in that were promised at a certain date or bonuses for certain purchases. As for not completing the DD line in a year, It's called FALSE ADVERTISING and I can't believe people are still grasping for arguments to embellish this poor conduct on 3A's part. people are legit with their complaints. 3A's business ethics suck!

by Guest Wed Sep 16, 2015 9:16 am

I have entitlement issues, it's true. I just wish things would be done how I want! There should be fan input in the designs of these toys! It is absolutely criminal that the S.H.Figuarts First Order Stormtrooper figure by Bandai Tamashii Nations includes a blaster rifle but not a blaster pistol. Every other company includes both with their version of the First Order Stormtrooper! So yeah I think I'm entitled to a god damn blaster pistol and don't tell me to buy the figure from those other companies because those ones are poor quality (Hasbro) or too expensive (Hot Toys). Explain to me how they could make this figure without this crucial accessory? Is it a cost issue? You're telling me they couldn't just gouge us for an extra 500 JPY? THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE BLASTER PISTOLS GOD DAMN IT!

by Musahi13 Wed Sep 16, 2015 9:35 am

ESeffinga wrote:I originally was intentionally not posting thoughts in this thread, but...

Chivo wrote:To speak on this point, I think when people say this, they mean the company doesn't owe you anything beyond what you have paid for and basic customer service. I think some folks who have supported a company for a long time sometimes get it in their mind that the company owes them something for all these years of support.

I think that is quite true. And it brings to mind a response Neil Gaiman wrote to a fan via his blog about 6 years ago, about this odd relationship of entitlement that fans often generate (including myself) about the "next" thing. In my case, I'm 3 Dirty Bertie's in and I'd like the other 9 to come as quickly as originally announced. But the only thing 3A really owes me art the first three that I ordered. I'm mentally invested in the WWR line, but it's been a slow grower for the last couple years. I see other lines taking away time from what I want to see, and I want more of what I like and get frustrated when I don't see it. I think we all do this to an extent.

Anyway, I highly recommend giving this a read, as it sometimes pops up in the back of my mind when I catch myself in this mindset.

http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2009/05/entitlement-issues.html

I get that three a doesn't really owe me anything unless I have paid and waited for it. However false promises and lack of communication when issues arise kinda suck the fun away.

I get that some of the early fans really helped spread the three a word with toy reviews and pictures and tons of fan based attention. It was a kind of grass roots advertising that helped the develop into a legit company. I find it sorta shitty that so many diehard fans were left by the wayside. Change is inevitable but it doesn't have to be shitty.
Just my opinion.

by dedguy Wed Sep 16, 2015 9:12 pm

I just wrote a very long reply but hit refresh by accident and lost it. So let me try this again…

I don't think it's unreasonable to have complaints about a company not delivering on promises. Even if that promise is for a product you haven't paid for yet. In the Dirty Deeds Bertie scenario I think it's even more reasonable. In that case you are buying part of a set based on the promise that you will be able to buy the rest of the set. Not making the whole set is essentially devaluing what you have already paid for. Devaluing in personal value sense not neccesarilly a monetary one.

When I am complaining about "entitled" being thrown around I'm not thinking about the extreme cases. What I have a problem with is when someone isn't given what they paid for and they haven't been given reasonable customer service. When the product looks noticeably different from what was promised, or is easily broken, or not of acceptable quality. I see a lot of people running to protect these companies and do so by throwing around loaded words like entitled. That kinda bugs me. I don't even get why anyone wants to protect a company or corporation in the first place.

I also admittedly have an issue with the word entitled ever since certain political movements have started throwing it around.

To comment on that Neil Gaiman article I don't think it really applies to companies or corporations. Parts of it might but the general gist of it I don't think does.

by Joshimus Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:39 am

You're right. It's not an "entitled" mindset to be upset at a poorly made product and if customer service isn't helping. That's more than fair for any product you buy. If I buy a really good blender and it craps out after a couple weeks, it's clearly defective. The maker of said blender should replace it. (not an actual example that happened to me but I work in tools so I see this shit a lot)
I've returned Hasbro toys to Toyrus or Walmart if they were defective, granted I don't wait a month, it's usually within a week I return. So it is fair to be judgemental about your purchases. In the case of 3A, or take even Hot Toys or Mattycollector, defective product getting replaced is a fair "entitled" complaint. Crying that a product due in Q3 is delayed to Q4, that's an "entitled" douche complaint. Delays happen. It's not the end of the world. If there is a long delay and items comes defective, that is ok to complain (about your figure not about the situation)

I don't consider 3A owing me anything other than what I have paid for. I would like to see more 2000AD bots and Dredd, and in time we may very well get that. TKlub is about a year off from when they had originally planned the releases and we finally got them all (or one left I think this month), but that's not a big deal to me. I'm glad I can finish off the TKlub line. It was fun and I really dig the figures. On that point, again with the dirty deeds comment, I really can't blame this person for being upset that "maybe" 3A will release them all. It is an investment on both parts. 3A needs the support and the buyer wants to believe they can complete their line. So that "entitled" mindset of 3A owing them is kinda fair to a point. Part of why I won't support the Star Wars 6" Black line is because in Canada, we can't f***ing find anything. So if I can't complete my heros and villains, why support the line at all? Same with Legacy Power Rangers. Can't find the movie pink ranger anywhere so I won't buy any of them. I won't support the line. That doesn't mean Bandai or Hasbro "owes" me, I have a whole room full of Hasbro product, but they don't owe me the figures I want. If I can't get them, I just don't buy any of them. It's my choice.

I guess at the end I think it is fair to still consider 3A a business first and I am sure they are still working out the kinks going I think only 8 years in. My niece is older than 3A. It takes time to fix issues. Bandai and Hasbro have been around for a lifetime. You can't fix new growth of a small company to adjust to the new and old bases that quickly. It takes time and mistakes and yes it is fair for people whom have been there since day 1 to be critical about it, so long as the complaints are just.

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